Topic: Energy management

I really dont mind the fact its a 5X multiplyer, but the attributes are seriously unfair for combat agents, and by far they'll be more combat agents then industrial, and any industrails will be alts, not really needing the skill.

So to balance this extension, there are two things that can be done - Change the attributes, or change the multiplyer.

Only one of the attributes really needs changing to help (preferably the primary;)).

Re: Energy management

Daniel wrote:

I really dont mind the fact its a 5X multiplyer, but the attributes are seriously unfair for combat agents, and by far they'll be more combat agents then industrial, and any industrails will be alts, not really needing the skill.

So to balance this extension, there are two things that can be done - Change the attributes, or change the multiplyer.

Only one of the attributes really needs changing to help (preferably the primary;)).

The reason behind this might just be that shields are made for miners.

Re: Energy management

I have to agree with the sentiment that energy managment is abit out of wack. As so many things count on it.

Its basicly a bread and butter skill ans managing your enery ingame can be pretty rough if you use lazors or EM guns.

I found my self running away alot of time from normal PVE just cause my cap was hitting its 10% with almost nothing done....

Re: Energy management

Common, because you have to buy 1 skill with industrial attributes you begin to ask lowest price?
I think it's not fair all the combat skills are combat attributes only.
I, as an industrial char, ask for all combat skills to be balanced with my needs.

Thank you devs tongue

Re: Energy management

oy thats not the reason tongue

just saying it such a important skill thats all...

Re: Energy management

Not to mention how many 5-8x skills industrial players have to get roll

Re: Energy management

Since the premiss of the game is to work in groups. Haveing folks specialized in Mining/Harvesting, and other specializeing in Combat is preferable. ALTs don't really make sence at all. You will be focuseing all your EP on 1 character at a time [or suffer slow progression doing multiples].

All characters no matter the occupation should focus on what makes thier speciality work best. Not trying to become a Jack of All Trades. JOTs will always suffer compared to Specalists. One Leader with good Bonuses to Squads is always a Plus. But the Key Word is SQUADs. Teams of players working/guarding one another from the nasty nature that is Human [Gank Squads]. No matter how good your Exstensions [skills] are if you come across multpile [player] opponents then you loose.

Re: Energy management

Maynard Benaui wrote:

The reason behind this might just be that shields are made for miners.

Who said anything about shields? Take a deep breath, take your head off, and put it on the right way round.

Rebecca Star wrote:

Since the premiss of the game is to work in groups. Haveing folks specialized in Mining/Harvesting, and other specializeing in Combat is preferable. ALTs don't really make sence at all. You will be focuseing all your EP on 1 character at a time [or suffer slow progression doing multiples].

All characters no matter the occupation should focus on what makes thier speciality work best. Not trying to become a Jack of All Trades. JOTs will always suffer compared to Specalists. One Leader with good Bonuses to Squads is always a Plus. But the Key Word is SQUADs. Teams of players working/guarding one another from the nasty nature that is Human [Gank Squads]. No matter how good your Exstensions [skills] are if you come across multpile [player] opponents then you loose.

Never played eve right?  (just the point out, im only basing this on the passive experience)  The game will attract players that own 2-3 sometimes even 4 accounts, for 1 person, i personally have two accounts on eve (as with perpetuum) one for fighting the other for mining/manufacturing/hauling.  And this game will be no different in that aspect.

True enough you do get people with more than one account on games like WoW, but not nearly as many as to a game with passive experiance gain.

Bambi wrote:

Common, because you have to buy 1 skill with industrial attributes you begin to ask lowest price?
I think it's not fair all the combat skills are combat attributes only.
I, as an industrial char, ask for all combat skills to be balanced with my needs.

Thank you devs tongue

I'm only asking for a little something, not alot wink

Felicia wrote:

Not to mention how many 5-8x skills industrial players have to get roll

Combat agents get those too roll

Last edited by Daniel (2010-01-12 01:22:46)

Re: Energy management

Daniel wrote:

Who said anything about shields? Take a deep breath, take your head off, and put it on the right way round.

Energy Management and Accumulator expansion use the same attributes as Shield related extensions - R&D and Heavy Industry.

Re: Energy management

Has no one here ever tried fitting and running multiple med miners on a termis? accumilator skills are massivly iportant to industry chars, infact all of my accu skills were purchased not for my combat / pve habits but for my mining ones.

Re: Energy management

Tailn wrote:

Has no one here ever tried fitting and running multiple med miners on a termis? accumilator skills are massivly iportant to industry chars, infact all of my accu skills were purchased not for my combat / pve habits but for my mining ones.

Accumulator extensions are Inportant to any Agent,  and its not like im asking for a full switch to tactics/Mechatronics, because if you look at other engineering skills, many are R&D/tactics ect ect. I'd just like to see the same on this extension like R&D/Mechatronics to give combat agents a tiny bit less punishment for this extension.

Maynard Benaui wrote:

Energy Management and Accumulator expansion use the same attributes as Shield related extensions - R&D and Heavy Industry.

No, you precieve shields as industry skill, when in fact they are meant for everyone.  Furthermore, the Training multiplyers are 2,2,3 respectively, which is alot less than x5 for energy management.  And once again, i NEVER mentioned anything about shields in the first place.

Last edited by Daniel (2010-01-12 14:24:37)

Re: Energy management

hmm, dont understand the problem

especially BECAUSE it is a necessary skill for everyone, i can clearly understand why it is so damn expensive.

i've noticed every single rank of energy-management with my bots. just like Basic robotics...

Re: Energy management

Bunkerkind Anni wrote:

hmm, dont understand the problem

especially BECAUSE it is a necessary skill for everyone, i can clearly understand why it is so damn expensive.

i've noticed every single rank of energy-management with my bots. just like Basic robotics...

Its just the cost of the skill, it uses R&D and heavy industry, two very non combat skills, other skills like robot control have balance by having industry or R&D as a secondary.

Last edited by Daniel (2010-01-12 22:36:33)

Re: Energy management

Laser users will be again shafted with this.

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Rawr, fear my signature.

Re: Energy management

Daniel wrote:

Combat agents get those too roll

But don't need have any use for these _industrial_ extensions. If you look at 'combat' and 'industry' you see that most low rank combat extensions are 1-3 multiplier and high rank extensions are 4-5. While low rank industry multipliers go from 1-3 (mining/harvesting) 1-4 (manufacturing) and high rank industry multipliers go from 4-5 (mining/harvesting) 5-9 (manufacturing).

And as stated before industrial pilots do need some accumulator skills later on.

Last edited by Felicia (2010-01-13 00:31:26)

Re: Energy management

Energy management is the basis of all it seems.
Dont matter if you run lasers/sheilds miners/em guns whatever....

The point is this is an essential skill for everyone, this is most likely why the multiplier is higher than on other skills. I highly doubt that it is an oversite by the devs\gms.

If you dont want to spend the points on it, because it is a 5x vs other skills, please feel free NOT to or TO spend the points on what you choose.

But when your cap is gone, and mine is full the winner will be obvious.

Re: Energy management

yeah, but guess what wepon group will get shafted most by it?

While others will be training damage on wepons, laser users must train this skill just to get  baisick thoretical damage.

Last edited by Siddy (2010-01-13 14:43:14)

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Rawr, fear my signature.

Re: Energy management

Siddy wrote:

yeah, but guess what wepon group will get shafted most by it?

While others will be training damage on wepons, laser users must train this skill just to get  baisick thoretical damage.

Don't Thelodica bots get huge accumulators to start with with good recharge rates? Compare it to Pelistal bots that get the smallest and worst recharge rates (and a shield defense bonus on top of it). Tried using a Castel or Waspish with armor reps? I've piloted every light and assault bot, and they all have their issues, and they're all hard up on accumulator with a given setup.

The accumulator is something that's used by ALL that use a bot in the field. It's just something that will have to be worked in. Maybe there needs to be an extension that lowers CPU usage of weapons by 3% per level like many of the other modules? Then it can all be taken in balance.

Re: Energy management

Fumen wrote:

Don't Thelodica bots get huge accumulators to start with with good recharge rates? Compare it to Pelistal bots that get the smallest and worst recharge rates (and a shield defense bonus on top of it). Tried using a Castel or Waspish with armor reps? I've piloted every light and assault bot, and they all have their issues, and they're all hard up on accumulator with a given setup.

The accumulator is something that's used by ALL that use a bot in the field. It's just something that will have to be worked in. Maybe there needs to be an extension that lowers CPU usage of weapons by 3% per level like many of the other modules? Then it can all be taken in balance.

No most Thelodica bots don't get that great accu bonus compared how much lasers need accu. Don't forgot that Thelodica bots also get shield bonus.

With wasphish: sure no problem I can run armor reps for a loong time with 3-4lvl accu extensions(both), while baphomet can shoot around 15-20 times (3-5 bots) after its accu is empty.

Problem with lasers is that all bots require accu for verious things, but lasers make t impossible to use these various things since lasers take way too much accu.
With both accu extensions at 6, accu recharger and 30% accu cap bonus my baphoment is no where near accu stable and drains accu fast if i try to use repper.

Fumen wrote:

Maybe there needs to be an extension that lowers CPU usage of weapons by 3% per level like many of the other modules? Then it can all be taken in balance.

Like Optimized weapon usage extension? "Each level of this extension reduces the CPU usage of weapons by additional 3%."
What does it help here anyway yikes

Re: Energy management

I think he wanted to say "accumulator" and mistyped cpu ^^

Re: Energy management

Bambi wrote:

I think he wanted to say "accumulator" and mistyped cpu ^^

Thank you smile Yes, meant accumulator.

Re: Energy management

Fumen wrote:
Bambi wrote:

I think he wanted to say "accumulator" and mistyped cpu ^^

Thank you smile Yes, meant accumulator.

So a skill that lowers ap usage for turrets. Something like 3% per level I guess. Works for me.

Re: Energy management

mmmm could we stop here with the multiplication of extensions needed please? ^^
We will soon reach 150 extensions i think ... it's enough ...

lasers energy consumption should, imo, be lowered. point.
I am full confident in devs, sure they will find a good balance smile

But pls, no new extension!!!