Topic: Remove Police Towers

Police towers on Beta islands are way to large and give players too much of a sense of safety on the Beta islands.

I suggest removing them altogether, if not just reducing the amount of them, so we can actually have an area of the game thats not secured 100%.

When you can bring a week old character to Beta and have them be just as productive because there is so much to do inside the police zones, something is wrong.

Fix this.

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-Edited GM Dehrios

Re: Remove Police Towers

I'm happy to tell you that they will be removed, and those areas will be changed to tighter non-aggression zones where you can't be attacked (unless you have a pvp-flag of course).

"I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody." -- Bill Cosby

Re: Remove Police Towers

just make it full pvp

Last edited by MadGelo (2010-08-08 21:52:20)

Grow up or die

Re: Remove Police Towers

MadGelo wrote:

just make it full pvp

Nah, that's for the next set of islands.

Re: Remove Police Towers

I don't think it's a good idea to get rid of them entirely.  I think they should still be placed near teleporters into the island and around the beta terminals so that you can't be insta-ganked the moment you attempt to enter the island or exit a terminal.

I do, however, agree with the sentiment that one shouldn't be able to do anything useful in the police zones.  That is, there should be no NPCs within shooting distance, no minerals, etc.

Re: Remove Police Towers

You will most likely be able to teleport in and be in the safe area that you cant even shoot someone when they are inside of it.  However, if you aggress someone inside of there you are unprotected like usual.

I think it could work.  Allows people to load into the area, but not go anywhere completely safe.

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-Edited GM Dehrios

Re: Remove Police Towers

Oh dear, no more free Argano kills smile.

Like the idea of having protected zone but all activities outside it.

Last edited by Widget (2010-08-09 00:08:14)

Re: Remove Police Towers

Widget wrote:

Oh dear, no more free Argano kills smile.

Like the idea of having protected zone but all activities outside it.


oooh yes.

Re: Remove Police Towers

And tonight on the 11 o'clock news:  Heavy Mech prices have sky rocketed!

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-Edited GM Dehrios

Re: Remove Police Towers

what you really need is a tool to find people outside because there are quite a lot of people there ... but island is big and it is always easier to gank under terminal
right ?

most of chars you see under terminal semi afk mining goes outside sentry range ...sometimes even far away of them ... but you fail to meet them
insted you are angry you can't gangk these miners - who - when you see them are mostly semi afking while doing some stuff in RL smile

on the other hand - mins are used to build bots / mech for people who mine there
these bots / mechs are used - or will be used soon out of sentries
nothing is sold on the market - no matter what current prices are smile and none are taken to noob islans back ... it is a process that will help this 2 week noob char to live / fight on pvp island instaed of keeping them for next few months out of it
but maybe I'm blind for it

so either train how to catch people out of safe zones .... or ask politely devs for tools to find them outside
for me 2 solution would be better
as for a few times we wanted to check enemy activity out of sentries we found only containers left behind

if you really really need to change it - leave sentry zones as they are and move resources , spawns out
bigger sentry zones means no one point camp place for gankers and a bit of effort to really control access to terminal ...


5km range 15 deg and 1min cooldown direction scanner would be nice

Last edited by Sneer Quen (2010-08-09 12:19:51)

Re: Remove Police Towers

Why is anyone asking more safty  in PVP zone when you got good 3 PVE islands where you are 100% safe?

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Re: Remove Police Towers

Siddy wrote:

Why is anyone asking more safty  in PVP zone when you got good 3 PVE islands where you are 100% safe?

Are you wondering why PVE players want more safety on PVP islands when you lock high end PVE content there?

It does not seem to be unreasonable request.

Re: Remove Police Towers

Well, in sandbox, the end mean of "player vs envoirment" will allways reflect to "player vs player"

So equation of "risk vs reward" comes to mind.

If you want more phat lewt, richer fields and beter quality facilities, be prepared to... negotiate for them, sometimes agressivly.

So, i am not realy wondering why PVE players want more securety for free. I wonder, why whuld we have free securety at all. After all, perpetuum is a sandbox simuation of the free word dynamics - a plase where there is as little as possible outside restrictions on player actions as possible.
If you understand sandbox model in MMO, you will know that "free" anything is often not valued, wanted in general by less competetive players and thats why it degrades the "risk vs reward".

So, please, can you tell me why whuld you want more "free" safty, that will eventualy devaluate the very item the people are after in PVP zones?

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Re: Remove Police Towers

Sneer - me likely
or make skill to expand range of what U can see and skill to shrunk ur visibility to other players (like stealth, depending on robot size and skill lvl)

also good idea seems to be making personal teleport working like safe logoff - 1min countdown and after it ur moved to nearest terminal/outpost (so express teleport between large distances would be impossible)
i know that login trap is a kind of a strategy but if someone want just to escape he/she have right to do it

combining all it together gives nice tools to hunt, be less visible, be more safe outside safe zones

@Siddy -i think that those island are not independent servers,so on pvp islands (for me wrong name for it) u still should be able to build something - mine,rat...
pvp island is not only for pvp and nothing more... if some corpwant to live there lat them, and don't make themto build infrastructure onpve islands and go to pvp island only for shooting... this smells like boring...

and i'm for example on pvp island to live there and don't have to go back on alpha islands never again... soyes i want sth that will make it possible... smile

Last edited by Porzeczka (2010-08-09 13:47:19)

Re: Remove Police Towers

i like this change

it has several advantages over the police-tower system.
- no more shot down by police tower because pvp flag went off
- no more gankers sniping into safe zones

disadvantages:
- no more difference between agressor and defender, but that was only usefull in 1v1
- i had more, but forget them.

Re: Remove Police Towers

Siddy wrote:

Well, in sandbox, the end mean of "player vs envoirment" will allways reflect to "player vs player"

So equation of "risk vs reward" comes to mind.

Your post consists of circular reasoning assuming the text above is true.

Can you provide a reasoning for that premise?


I respect your assumptions in the second half of your post as your opinion but they still do not make a point though.

Re: Remove Police Towers

In sandbox type of game, you are eventlauly ending up compeeting allways against another player.

Be it; hogging spawn, mining fat fields empty, undercutting prices or killing mechs.
Whenever you win, somebody loses. The fact, that the loss  is not as blatantly obvios when you compare it to direct kill of a maech, does not remove the fact that you are potentialy stepping on someone elses toes.

If you are happy with doublestandards of what "pvp" is, then sanbox type of game is probably not your cup of tea.

You need to always bear in mind that the initiative, risk managment and organisation must be rewardet more than abusing the free security providet by the game system.

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Re: Remove Police Towers

Siddy wrote:

In sandbox type of game, you are eventlauly ending up compeeting allways against another player.

Be it; hogging spawn, mining fat fields empty, undercutting prices or killing mechs.
Whenever you win, somebody loses. The fact, that the loss  is not as blatantly obvios when you compare it to direct kill of a maech, does not remove the fact that you are potentialy stepping on someone elses toes.

If you are happy with doublestandards of what "pvp" is, then sanbox type of game is probably not your cup of tea.

You need to always bear in mind that the initiative, risk managment and organisation must be rewardet more than abusing the free security providet by the game system.

Sorry, but you just repeat what you have said already, and it is again a circular reasoning.

Statement 'eventually ending up competing always' makes no sense at all.
You have to pick one conditional, being it eventually or always, it can't be both, they are mutually exclusive.

Re: Remove Police Towers

I am tempted to draw you a picture, but i rather save my energy for somethin that matters.

Rather than that, i whuld sugjest that you did your homework on what "sandbox" concept means.

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Re: Remove Police Towers

*edit* Trolling. - DEV Zoom

Grow up or die

Re: Remove Police Towers

Siddy the sandbox concept doesnt specifically mean pvp like you seem to think it does. Its an open-ended world where you gain the ability to do many things going in a non-linear direction. Essentially, you can go into more detail, but Im attempting to be brief.

You could have a sandbox that punished you heavily for pvp (so heavy that noone partook in it) and it would still be a sandbox. All because the options are available.

@Madgelo, Trolling accomplishes nothing. Addressing and refuting Maynard's points on the other hand, does. So from a outsiders perspective, you look like a spoilt brat who can not form a valid argument (although I know that is certainly not the truth).

Siddy, the truth of the matter is. You PvPers need us PvErs and we need you. You take down police zones on the beta islands, and in the current state of the game, are inviting a ghost town.

Re: Remove Police Towers

back to topic!

topic was: police towers, not "PvE vs. PvP"

“The truth is balance. However the opposite of truth, which is unbalance, may not be a lie.”
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Re: Remove Police Towers

You are making the mistake to segmenting sanbox player base to "pvpers and pvers"

Infact there is only PVPers.

Like i sed, you have Classic pixiebasher mmo standards imported in to sandbox mmo.
Statment like "You PvPers need us PvErs and we need you" is more than enought of proof that you have no clue what i am talking abut.

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Re: Remove Police Towers

GM Kami wrote:

back to topic!

topic was: police towers, not "PvE vs. PvP"

Police effects the "PVP" directly by removing the risk from the reward.

To find the fitting solution in the localised securety and how it will be implimented, you first must understand why free protection in hostrile zone can be harmful to game.

Last edited by Siddy (2010-08-09 14:12:27)

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Re: Remove Police Towers

Siddy wrote:

Like i sed, you have Classic pixiebasher mmo standards imported in to sandbox mmo.
Statment like "You PvPers need us PvErs and we need you" is more than enought of proof that you have no clue what i am talking abut.


Ahh, picking one aspect of my argument, then bashing it with not facts, but your oppinion. You sir, are classy.


I bolded it this time so you may see it.

You take down police zones on the beta islands, and in the current state of the game, are inviting a ghost town.

Last edited by Gloryhole (2010-08-09 14:13:58)